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Erik
Member
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Posted: Sun Dec 30th, 2007 10:51 pm |
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My question is triggered by this post of Alligatorob. May I ask what the exact reason is for wanting to exclude the bats from the building? What is the particular problem with these bats?
The reason that I ask this is that I have noticed that there is a entirely different approach in how to deal with bats in house in the US compared with how we deal with it in the Netherlands.
First let me check if I understand this right: In (most?) US-states it is perfectly legal to exclude bats from a building. There a companies that are specialised in bat exclusion and since the success of artificial nursery houses, exclusion is often accompanied by placing a bat house on the same building, a neighboring building or on poles. I even heard that in some states it is not allowed to tolerate bats in your house. That is: a house where people live as well. A barn is different thing.
I guess the facts that some American neighborhood bats may have rabies (classical Lyssa-virus) is a important reason for this policy. Are there other reasons? Do bats in house always cause nuisance (noise, stench, bat droppings, bats flying around in the house?)?
In the Netherlands all bat species are protected by law (European law as well as Dutch law). This means that is not allowed to kill bats, catch and relocate bats or destroy roosts unless you get a special license for it. For relocating bats and destroying roosts you need a permit for every single occasion. Sealing the entrance of a bat roost to prevent bats getting in (or out) is equal to destroying a roost so that is forbidden as well. The actions are also forbidden in periods when the bats are not using the roost at that time (summer roost / winter roost). In fact, when human activities destroy foraging habitats and/or essential flyways in a way that bats from a certain roost can't survive anymore, than those activities are prohibited under the same law. That means whenever a developer or the government wants to destroy one or more buildings or wants cut down trees, for example for building a new road, they have to investigate if the building / tree has a bat roost in it. (And that's where I come in: that kind of bat research is my job.
But when someone discovers bats in their home, it is also not allowed to exclude them. Only when its very clear that the bats cause nuisance like stench or noise, then it is allowed to do something about that. But first it must be certain that no other measures can be taken to stop the nuisance, before you are can get a permit to exclude the bats. There are no or maybe just a few companies that work in that field, most work is done by voluntary bat researchers and conservationists. I do that kind of voluntary work as well. Dealing with complaints about bats is 80% educating people about that bats are not dangerous (they don't attack you or drink blood, they don't destroy the house etcetera). Only when there is a real nuisance we help people to exclude bats. Also when people are so scared of bats or stand ground in their hate against bats that we are afraid that they will kill the bats anyway.
There might be different reasons for this different approach:
- we don't have have classical rabies in our neighbourhood bats. We have European Lyssa virus but in the whole of Europe we have three incidents where someone got rabies from a bat in the last 100 year. We are careful, but there is no great danger.
- almost all of our house are brick or concrete houses and a lot of neighbourhood bats live in wall cavities of roof cavities. Nuisance like stench and noise is very rare.
- we have a cool climate (colder than south-US) and bats stay in torpor most of the day and may cause noise nuisance only in the evening and morning.
There are houses from which I know there have been more than 100 bats roosting in the roof and the owners are still not aware that they have bats.
Are there in the US (in your area) a lot of examples of bats that are allowed to remain in there roost, whilst roosting in a building where also people live?
I am not saying that our approach is better than yours. I'm a just interested in the different ways we deal with bats in houses.
Erik
(P.S. English is not my own language so forgive me if I make mistakes in writing...)
Last edited on Sun Dec 30th, 2007 10:52 pm by Erik
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Gran
Member
| Joined: | Wed Sep 8th, 2004 |
| Location: | Dothan, Alabama USA |
| Posts: | 47 |
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Posted: Wed Jan 2nd, 2008 02:13 am |
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I think it a combination of lots of things. Construction methods are generally wood framed with dry wall interior . It doesn't take much urine odor to soak through and smell up house. Another problem is a that many people here view bats as rats with wings. They view them as a pest to be gotten rid of. Maybe that view is changing but it is a slow process. AT least where I live rabies is a major problem in wild mammal population. There have even been rabid squirrels reported in area.
Do the bats in your area take well to houses like we put up here? If not then it may be that it is more difficult to get them to transfer to that style house vs the one that they are in now
Others online have much more knowledge but that is my guesses
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Terry Lobdell
Member
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Posted: Wed Jan 2nd, 2008 05:28 am |
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Erik, most of the time in the USA stench is a problem with bats roosting in a residence. Also, dust from guano can cause respriatory problems for some people.
I do know some people who are able to tolerate bats roosting in their home. A lot of it depends on the type of home construction, where inside the home the bats are roosting and how many bats there are.
I live in the NE USA and my guess is that most of our bat population roosts within man made structures, mostly homes and barns. Kent or Joe may know more about this.
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IowaNate
Member
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Posted: Thu Jan 3rd, 2008 01:30 am |
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| I live in the middle of the USA in the state of Iowa. Even though bat conservation and education has come a long way, most people in my area still view them as pests. A lot of people would rather smack them with a hard object and kill them in their homes rather than remove them gently and release them outside. Granted, there are a lot of people that don't even know bats are living among them, but if they did encounter bats in their homes they would kill them without hesitation. Rabies is very over-exploited in Iowa, and it has induced unnecessary fears in people. I have been bitten by several bats while "rescuing" them from houses when people wanted to kill them & I had no gloves on. I wouldn't recommend anyone doing this, but I have never contracted any disease from a bat.
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Erik
Member
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Posted: Thu Jan 3rd, 2008 02:00 pm |
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@Gran: in The Netherlands there are very few bat houses made that are suitable for replacing roosts in buildings. Mine (see Dutch Bat House) in this Forum is one of only about 5 or 10 in The Netherlands and is the only one that is used by bats. I am plannng to build houses more this year.
@Terry en Gran: I guess less than 5% procent of the buildings in The Netherlands are made from wood. Most of our building are made of concrete and/or bricks. Only roof construction contains bigger wooden structures. Therefor it might be more difficult to transfer bats to wooden house.
Because of the use of bricks and concrete and ventilated wall cavities urine, guano and stench problems are less smaller.
@Terry: I guess respriatory problems from Guano are biggest in humid and hot areas/places where fungus can grow on the Guano. I know histoplasmosis is caused by guano-fungi. It is very rare in Europe.
@IowaNate: most people see bats as pests here as well and scary-fairy-stories about bats do the rest. Fortunatly a lot of people here are very Nature minded (we have very little nature in The Netherlands) and with good education about bats there are more and more people who tolerate them. A few years ago there was even a House for Sale-advertisement that advertised with having bats in the attic and the buyers of the house had to sign papers in which they promised to conserve the bats!
House-owners that love their bats can get a sign tot put up on the wall that says that they are proud of having bats in their home.
Erik
P.S. Happy New Year to you all!
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Terry Lobdell
Member
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Posted: Thu Jan 3rd, 2008 09:44 pm |
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Erik, It sounds like bat conservation has a high priority in the Netherlands. That is great to hear!
Where I live here in Pennsylvania it does get very humid in the summer. That is usually the time when bats roosting in attics find their way into the living space of people's homes. Mostly likely they are trying to find a cooler place to roost and get lost within the building.
I'm hoping maybe someday bat houses might be architecturally incorporated into people's homes. I hope to experiment with this in the future possibly as an attic vent design. I think Joe's soffit vent design has a lot of potential in this area.
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